UF Student Tasered at Kerry Speech

[Thrashdragon]

http://www.villagevoice.com/blogs/runninscared/archives/2007/09/florida_student.php

[darth_nevus]

i saw that on the news this morning. i hope he sue the piss out of them. especially after his comments while its happening. misconduct if i ever heard it...

[GeneralSnake]

YAY!! More idiot, inexpereinced and trigger happy cops that are exposed! They need to go.

[unorignal]

Now kids remember to do what the police officer tells you to.

[Rand{CLR}]

When I saw the report, witnesses were saying the dude was already on his stomach and cuffed when they zapped him. If so, he's going to make himself a lot of money.

-Rand

[Thrashdragon]

There's more to this story according to the comments posted on a youtube version of this by the kid that filmed it. In that version, apparently the kid came running into the hall pursued by the cops, they were about to arrest him and Kerry said he'd answer the kid's question. So he was already in trouble (no idea why there were chasing him in the first place, but that's why they were standing behind him), and apparently went over his allotted time and wouldn't relinquish the microphone, at which point they started to remove him.

There are a couple of other versions floating around. I figure there are probably at least half a dozen different videos of it, I've already seen two.

While whatever they were originally after him for may or may not have been justified, the tasering was by the book. He was continuing to verbally and physically resist. Doesn't matter if he's already down and cuffed, if you are resisting in any way they are allowed to tase you. You do know that just raising your voice to a police officer can get you tasered, right? It really doesn't matter WHY you're being detained, on the scene with the arresting officer is NOT the place to argue the matter. Keep your mouth shut and do what they tell you to do, and fight it out in court. No matter who's right or wrong, resisting a law enforcement officer is always a stupid thing to do. You're still going to get arrested, you'll get beated down, zapped, and have even more charges pending.

I look forward to seeing the full story of what exactly happened here.

[juneau]

I'm sorry but i found that completely disgusting. Has it really gone that far in the US where you can get tased for something so small? Can't 6+ cops arrest and remove one man, that to put it bluntly isn't putting up much of a fight without the use of a taser?

I saw something a while back where a traffic cop was recorded on his own dash cam physically removing a women from her car because he was having a bad day.

Total over use of power. :|

I'd love to know what he did. Especially as the cops held off while he asked a question. I bet it was something stupid like queue jumping.

[ThisElfRocksHard]

While whatever they were originally after him for may or may not have been justified, the tasering was by the book. He was continuing to verbally and physically resist. Doesn't matter if he's already down and cuffed, if you are resisting in any way they are allowed to tase you. You do know that just raising your voice to a police officer can get you tasered, right? It really doesn't matter WHY you're being detained, on the scene with the arresting officer is NOT the place to argue the matter. Keep your mouth shut and do what they tell you to do, and fight it out in court. No matter who's right or wrong, resisting a law enforcement officer is always a stupid thing to do. You're still going to get arrested, you'll get beated down, zapped, and have even more charges pending.




Ummm...what? Since when? Silence is a right, not an order. I spent four years studying law, and this is the first time I have heard of this. As long as a suspect doesn't shout somethig to the effect of, "I'm going to kill you!", then they aren't guilty of resisting arrest. If this is something that is in the lawbooks, I would love to see it.

Additionally, Seeing as how he was on the ground and restrained already, the taser was obviously unnecessary. Every officer can thank whatever deity they pray to that that guy did not have a pacemaker, or it could possibly be murder charges for them.

Edited because I believe that there is an "s" in the word, "seeing"

[Thrashdragon]

Ummm...what? Since when? Silence is a right, not an order. I spent four years studying law, and this is the first time I have heard of this. As long as a suspect doesn't shout somethig to the effect of, "I'm going to kill you!", then they aren't guilty of resisting arrest. If this is something that is in the lawbooks, I would love to see it.

Additionally, eeing as how he was on the ground and restrained already, the taser was obviously unnecessary. Every officer can thank whatever deity they pray to that that guy did not have a pacemaker, or it could possibly be murder charges for them.

Use of force guidelines permit tasering a subject that is verbally resisting arrest or being verbally disruptive. In fact, the training video shown to the deputies at my old agency showed a truck driver being tased on a traffic stop after the officer repeatedly asks him to stop yelling (and he's not threatening the officer, he's just ranting).

I'm not saying whether that's right or wrong, but there's nothing in that video that shows wrongdoing by the officers according to Florida law.

As far as him being on the ground...before tasers, they would've used fists or a nightstick to get him to stop struggling. Personally I'd rather be tasered than clubbed.

Turns out this kid runs a website where he posts videos of him playing pranks on people, looks like he took this one a little too far.

[ThisElfRocksHard]

Ummm...what? Since when? Silence is a right, not an order. I spent four years studying law, and this is the first time I have heard of this. As long as a suspect doesn't shout somethig to the effect of, "I'm going to kill you!", then they aren't guilty of resisting arrest. If this is something that is in the lawbooks, I would love to see it.

Additionally, Seeing as how he was on the ground and restrained already, the taser was obviously unnecessary. Every officer can thank whatever deity they pray to that that guy did not have a pacemaker, or it could possibly be murder charges for them.

Use of force guidelines permit tasering a subject that is verbally resisting arrest or being verbally disruptive. In fact, the training video shown to the deputies at my old agency showed a truck driver being tased on a traffic stop after the officer repeatedly asks him to stop yelling (and he's not threatening the officer, he's just ranting).



I hate to repeat myself here:

If this is something that is in the lawbooks, I would love to see it.

[lady-MGS]

It was obvious that they didn't have him cuffed when they tasered him. He's walking towards the Senator, a Government Official, it's not like he can keep going. Know one knows what the hell he was going to do. They asked him numerous times to stop and he didn't. He's lucky they didn't shoot him.

I love watching cops because of stupid people like that. They think they can do whatever they feel and there will be no consequence to there actions. Something must have happened for the cops to be standing behind him to begin with and I don't think it was as innocent as they are trying portray.

[Thrashdragon]

I hate to repeat myself here:

If this is something that is in the lawbooks, I would love to see it.

AFAIK, individual departments' use of force guidelines are the only things that specifically address taser use, since the widespread use of them is fairly new. There's nothing statutory that I'm aware of (although I'm not in that business anymore and could have easily missed it), and while I'm sure there will be some case law at some point, it will probably be on a state-by-state basis and therefore woefully inconsistent anyway. I believe there is a bill being written to prohibit the use of tasers on minors in DOJJ custody, but I'm not aware of anything else that even mentions them.

I'm just passing along what the rules were when I worked for a law enforcement agency a couple of years ago, if you want to argue their legality you'll need to look elsewhere.

[Thrashdragon]

UF student Tyler Antar was there and e-mails his account of what happened.


So I went to the John Kerry town hall forum this morning trying to get students registered to vote. I run a student government organization called Chomp the Vote. Anyway I went inside to watch the event. Senator Kerry took the podium and began delivering a speech about the Middle East, Iraq, dimplomacy, etc. Anyway, after he was done, a university ambassador asked Kerry a few premade questions. Once that was over, Senator Kerry announced he would take questions from the students.

There were two microphones placed on each side of the aisle. One on my side and the other on Andrew Meyer?s side. Senator Kerry began answering the student?s questions from each aisle. Eventually it was announced that there would only be a few more questions answered. Since Meyer and I were both in the back of each line, it did not seem likely that our questions would be answered.

However, while Senator Kerry was responding to a student?s question, all of a sudden Meyer rushed to the microphone with cops in pursuit. At that point no one knew what was going on. Could he have a gun, a bomb?

Immediately, Meyer began yelling into the microphone that he had been waiting in line forever and that Senator Kerry should ?spend time to answer everyone?s questions!? Senator Kerry tried to calm the student down by telling him that he would ?stay here as long as it takes to get the questions answered.?

The police approached Meyer who began taunting them by saying ?what! are you going to taser me? are you going to arrest me?!? The police grabbed Meyer, but Senator Kerry asked the police to let him go and that he would answer his question. Senator Kerry finished answering the other student?s question and then proceeded with Meyer. (*This entire scene is not in any video I can find so far. This is why 2 cops are seen right behind Meyer at the start of some videos*).

Meyer approached the microphone and began to talk about a book he had which stated that Kerry won the 2004 election because of disenfranchisement of black voters and faulty voter machines that produced ?Bush? as the winner. He then posed another question about why President Bush had not been impeached. ?President Clinton was impeached because of a *******, why not Bush??. The third and strangest question he posed to Senator Kerry was asking him if he was part of the skull and bones society with Bush at Yale. Meyer?s mic cut off after that, probably because he had mentioned the word ?*******?. The cops grabbed him, but Meyer was able to get away several times. Eventually more cops were brought in to help subdue Meyer.

Meyer continued to resist arrest, scream, curse; however he was enventually subdued by about six cops up around the entrance. As he is on the ground, he is told several times to put his hands around his back. He is also warned that he will be tasered if he does not comply. Eventually he is tasered twice. The video does not show whether he complied or not.

Senator Kerry was trying to answer his question to the audience, mostly the one about faulty voter machines. I am a die hard conservative Republican but I do respect Senator Kerry for trying to soothe the situation as best he could and trying not to escalate the situation. He DID intervene by letting the student at least present his question. I never received an opportunity to ask my question, but when Senator Kerry ended the show after the Meyer incident, he did come off stage to shake hands and give autographs. At that point, I was able to ask him my question, shake his hand, and get a autograph at the same time. Now why couldn?t Andrew Meyer do that?

I don?t know if this is relevant or not, but Andrew Meyer is a former sports writer for the school newspaper The Alligator. In his columns, he has been known to make ridiculous statements in order to gain attention for himself. Was today a publicity stunt?

If this is the true account, kid got what he deserved.

[Alley_Viper]

There was alot more to the story than what is shown in the video. He was allowed to be heard (not that he should have been anyways. Time and place for everything.) When he started criticizing and pushing out accusations, it was time for him to be escorted out by the police. He could have been charged with disorderly conduct from the start, but they tried to let it slide. When they tried to usher him from the hall and he started pulling away shouting all that crap he stepped into resisting.
I would have hit him with the taser a lot sooner than they did.
Yes there were 6 cops there, but the same people you are reading who are spouting off with the "bad cop" crap would have been really mouthing off if those 6 cops would have pounded him into a pulp until he limply rolled over to be cuffed.
Before people start jumping on the bash-a-cop bandwagon you need to look at all sides of an issue. Next person who wants to mouth off about how it took 6 cops to put someone in cuffs, try it yourself. YOU actually try to get something as small as a set of cuffs on someone who is jacked up on adrenalin and squirming all over the place. DO THAT WHILE TRYING NOT TO HURT THE PRICK!
And for the record, the guy was NOT in restraints when he was hit with the taser. He was placed in restraints after realizing that electricity hurts like hell and didnt want to play anymore. The word "OW" is alot nicer sounding than the unmistakable sound of breaking bone or teeth hitting the floor.
Sorry for the rant but people have no idea how sick I am of hearing/reading Bad cop this or bad cop that. I have been in Law Enforcement for 11 years now and I hear this kind of crap almost every night. It always comes down to being a bad cop until it is you that is getting jacked by someone or becomes a victim. Then when a cop comes and busts his ass for you, it's "that cop was cool man! That idiot won't be bothering me anymore." Give me a break.
There has been more than one time that I have seen someone getting jacked after mouthing off to me only a few days before. I will be honest, there was a second or two that my mind was telling me to let his ass get stomped and let him see me watching it happen. I bet he will have lots to bash me about next week when he can walk again. Do I actually let it happen? No. I put myself in harms way to keep him from taking a bus ride to the E.R. Why? Because it is my job, and because contrary to popular belief from all the bashers out there, we actually do give a damn.

[ThisElfRocksHard]

AFAIK, individual departments' use of force guidelines are the only things that specifically address taser use, since the widespread use of them is fairly new. There's nothing statutory that I'm aware of (although I'm not in that business anymore and could have easily missed it), and while I'm sure there will be some case law at some point, it will probably be on a state-by-state basis and therefore woefully inconsistent anyway. I believe there is a bill being written to prohibit the use of tasers on minors in DOJJ custody, but I'm not aware of anything else that even mentions them.

I'm just passing along what the rules were when I worked for a law enforcement agency a couple of years ago, if you want to argue their legality you'll need to look elsewhere.

Fair enough. Although I think this is more of a case of what constitutes resisting arrest (I keep finding things for Missouri, nothing for Florida), rather than the use of the taser specifically.

[ThisElfRocksHard]

I would have hit him with the taser a lot sooner than they did.
Yes there were 6 cops there, but the same people you are reading who are spouting off with the "bad cop" crap would have been really mouthing off if those 6 cops would have pounded him into a pulp until he limply rolled over to be cuffed.
Before people start jumping on the bash-a-cop bandwagon you need to look at all sides of an issue. Next person who wants to mouth off about how it took 6 cops to put someone in cuffs, try it yourself. YOU actually try to get something as small as a set of cuffs on someone who is jacked up on adrenalin and squirming all over the place. DO THAT WHILE TRYING NOT TO HURT THE *****!
And for the record, the guy was NOT in restraints when he was hit with the taser. He was placed in restraints after realizing that electricity hurts like hell and didnt want to play anymore. The word "OW" is alot nicer sounding than the unmistakable sound of breaking bone or teeth hitting the floor.


I respect your opinion, but I see articles like this: 70 Deaths After Use Of Stun Gun Lead To Questions Over Its Safety
(http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2004/10/12/earlyshow/main648859.shtml) and I am wondering if this technology has been tested adequately. On the one hand, a little electric jolt might seem preferable to a beating, but on the other, if someone has cardiac arrythmia (a condition a law enforcement officer is regrettably unlikely to be aware of), the use of the taser could effectively be a death sentence.

[juneau]

There was alot more to the story than what is shown in the video. He was allowed to be heard (not that he should have been anyways. Time and place for everything.) When he started criticizing and pushing out accusations, it was time for him to be escorted out by the police. He could have been charged with disorderly conduct from the start, but they tried to let it slide. When they tried to usher him from the hall and he started pulling away shouting all that crap he stepped into resisting.
I would have hit him with the taser a lot sooner than they did.
Yes there were 6 cops there, but the same people you are reading who are spouting off with the "bad cop" crap would have been really mouthing off if those 6 cops would have pounded him into a pulp until he limply rolled over to be cuffed.
Before people start jumping on the bash-a-cop bandwagon you need to look at all sides of an issue. Next person who wants to mouth off about how it took 6 cops to put someone in cuffs, try it yourself. YOU actually try to get something as small as a set of cuffs on someone who is jacked up on adrenalin and squirming all over the place. DO THAT WHILE TRYING NOT TO HURT THE PRICK!
And for the record, the guy was NOT in restraints when he was hit with the taser. He was placed in restraints after realizing that electricity hurts like hell and didnt want to play anymore. The word "OW" is alot nicer sounding than the unmistakable sound of breaking bone or teeth hitting the floor.
Sorry for the rant but people have no idea how sick I am of hearing/reading Bad cop this or bad cop that. I have been in Law Enforcement for 11 years now and I hear this kind of crap almost every night. It always comes down to being a bad cop until it is you that is getting jacked by someone or becomes a victim. Then when a cop comes and busts his ass for you, it's "that cop was cool man! That idiot won't be bothering me anymore." Give me a break.
There has been more than one time that I have seen someone getting jacked after mouthing off to me only a few days before. I will be honest, there was a second or two that my mind was telling me to let his ass get stomped and let him see me watching it happen. I bet he will have lots to bash me about next week when he can walk again. Do I actually let it happen? No. I put myself in harms way to keep him from taking a bus ride to the E.R. Why? Because it is my job, and because contrary to popular belief from all the bashers out there, we actually do give a damn.

No offense but i've seen two of our cops take down a guy bigger than that and get him cuffed. All without the use of a taser. Don't get me wrong though. I'm not bashing the cops or the use of tasers, but it seems that tasers are being too frequently used as the easy option.

I would still like to see a full video if anybody can post some links.

[Thrashdragon]

Fair enough. Although I think this is more of a case of what constitutes resisting arrest (I keep finding things for Missouri, nothing for Florida), rather than the use of the taser specifically.

There's always room left to leave a lot left up to the officer's judgment. Sometimes that is a bad thing, but if you make too many rules/laws then officers will be afraid to take any action without checking with their entire chain of command, and people will get hurt. In the end, the situation was resolved and no one was injured, and that's what is important.

I think the benefits of using a taser to immediately take down 99.9% of subjects in a safe manner far outweigh the potential danger of accidentally triggering a heart attack in a junkie. Seems to me that if you have a heart problem, maybe you should be a little more inclined to not resist arrest.

[L_Mo]

No offense but i've seen two of our cops take down a guy bigger than that and get him cuffed. All without the use of a taser. Don't get me wrong though. I'm not bashing the cops or the use of tasers, but it seems that tasers are being too frequently used as the easy option.

I don't disagree that using a taser is easier than physically wrestling them to the ground, but that's not the safest option. Those two cops could have made a mistake, or the big guy could have pulled a move and taken the cops down.

I'm quite liberal, but in my book if a cop says "If you keep resisting, I'm going to taser you" then the use of a taser is justified. As far as I know there are no long term effects, it just hurts... I'd rather see someone get shocked than hit in the face.

Now, I can't comment on the safety... If there have been deaths due to taser use obviously that needs to be investigated. If there -is- a chance of death.. well.. in that case I'd rather see someone get hit in the face than die...

[mapes]

Lets just say I don't know what to think.

I will state in all and I do mean all interactions with people who are armed with lethal and non-lethal weapons my movements and demeanor are non confrontational. If I'm in a car and I'm pulled over I actually roll down the drivers windows and stick my hands out of the window. If I'm on a bike I take off my helmet and pull the the key outta the ignition. You'd be surprised how many times I've been let go from speed infractions.....

[WhIsKyTaNgO1]

All a cop has to do is yell, "Stop Resisting!!!" and he is clear to tase

[WhIsKyTaNgO1]

follow up,, In South Bend, Indiana an elderly man was tased for non compliance, he had Alhzheimers :?

[juneau]

follow up,, In South Bend, Indiana an elderly man was tased for non compliance, he had Alhzheimers :?

Ridiculous! :pissed:

[TheSilentAssassin]

When I saw the report, witnesses were saying the dude was already on his stomach and cuffed when they zapped him. If so, he's going to make himself a lot of money.

-Rand

Just watched that...possible case of police brutality (again) ?

[unorignal]

When I saw the report, witnesses were saying the dude was already on his stomach and cuffed when they zapped him. If so, he's going to make himself a lot of money.

-Rand

Just watched that...possible case of police brutality (again) ?

For resisting arrest?

[thedeadlyassassin]

I don't find it disgusting, but I find it very unneccisary. There was no need to Tase the guy, they seemed to have him under control. I heard someone yelling "police brutality!" after the tase, and I'd have to agree with that. There was no need for him to be tased, and if a cop has the right to tase someone after "demanding" permission by saying it to the person, that is wrong.

Police have too much power. I myself fear the police more then I feel protected by them.


I heard a story of a police officer that shot and killed a 6 year old kid wielding a squirt gun in the dark. Are you serious? You think a person of that size (it was a normal 6 year old kid, height, weight, everything seemed right) would be walking around town with an assualt rifle? Or has that cop been playing too much doom and he thought it was a BFG?

I also was watching Cops awhile back. A man was being racists to a Mexican restraurant manager, and was yelling at many Mexican people at the restaurant.

Yes, racism is wrong, but how is power slamming the guy off his feet by the throat better then arresting him for resisting arrest (he refused to put his hands out his pockets, which he obviously had NO weapon in, half hand in half out) by grabbing his arms and forcing them behind his back.

I don't want to offend anyone that is a police officer here, but I personally hate cops :|

[lady-MGS]

I will admit that I live in a sheltered town. Not many things happen here but I still am beyond thankful that I have the protection of our sheriff's office.

If you can say that that was police brutality when the guy goes charging to the stage and they acted the way they did is wrong, then that's messed up. If the officers wouldn't have reacted at all and the guy had a gun and shot Kerry or went on some shooting spree, then everyone would be going after those officers for not doing there job.

They are damned if they do and damned if they don't. There's no winning in that occupation.

I feel like a dumb a** for asking AlleyViper to put his 2 cents in because he is one who risks his life everyday to help keep us protected. I will still say Thank You.


I am also with TD.. If you have a heart problem or any other problem that could make being arrested being hazardous to your health, then what the heck are you getting in trouble for?

[ThisElfRocksHard]

I think the benefits of using a taser to immediately take down 99.9% of subjects in a safe manner far outweigh the potential danger of accidentally triggering a heart attack in a junkie. Seems to me that if you have a heart problem, maybe you should be a little more inclined to not resist arrest.

This is where we are going to disagree forever. I don't care if you change your statement to include 99.99999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999 99999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999 9% of subjects in a safe manner. The problem is that the penalty for resisting arrest should never be death. Also, your final statement, "if you have a heart problem, maybe you should be a little more inclined to not resist arrest" looks like sound advice--but what if you have an unknown heart problem? I don't think I have heart arrythmia, but to be honest, if you stuck a gun (or a taser :twisted: ) to my head, I couldn't honestly tell you.

[ThisElfRocksHard]

If you can say that that was police brutality when the guy goes charging to the stage and they acted the way they did is wrong, then that's messed up.


I have been looking at this video for awhile, and I can't see how he is "charging the stage". The only time he is advancing towards the stage is 27 seconds into the video, where he has his back to the stage and gets momentarily free from the police and raises his hands (after which he is clearly restrained by the officers). Keep in mind, it is REAL easy to look at this after the fact and make judgements about the officers' conduct, but it still seems to me that the tasering was unneccesary and cruel.

[baconoclock]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasnt the taser toted as a less-than-lethal weapon? I thought it was supposed to be used in situations where officers whould normally have had to use their service weapon in defense?

It seems to me that the taser is the new Cap. spray...

[Thrashdragon]

This is where we are going to disagree forever. I don't care if you change your statement to include 99.99999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999 99999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999 9% of subjects in a safe manner. The problem is that the penalty for resisting arrest should never be death. Also, your final statement, "if you have a heart problem, maybe you should be a little more inclined to not resist arrest" looks like sound advice--but what if you have an unknown heart problem? I don't think I have heart arrythmia, but to be honest, if you stuck a gun (or a taser :twisted: ) to my head, I couldn't honestly tell you.

You're right, death is too harsh a penalty for resisting arrest, but tasering a subject is not meant to be "punishment", it's done to force him to comply. We're obviously going to disagree on this, but I feel that officers having the ability to safely and quickly incapacitate a subject from a distance without using a firearm, or having to close on the subject and engage him in hand to hand combat, outweighs the worry of them possibly lethally injuring a subject with a medical condition. A subject that is, after all, breaking the law.

I was a pretty bad kid way back when, but when a cop told me to do something, I shut up and did it. I don't have any sympathy for some little "I'm entitled to everything" college student looking for his 15 minutes of internet fame.

On a side note, it turns out this whole thing was staged. The camera used to film this event belonged to Meyer (the tasered student), and he handed it to another student, told her to film what was going to happen next, and at one point in his rant stopped and asked her if she was getting everything. Once in the squad car, Meyer became lighthearted and was joking with the cops, told them he had no hard feelings and that they were just doing their jobs, and inquired if the media would be present when he was being booked. :roll:

Just another wannabe youtube celebrity.

[{CLR} ObiTroy]

Well said, thashdragon.

The kid got what he wanted: Attention. He also got what he deserved.

[L_Mo]

You're right, death is too harsh a penalty for resisting arrest, but tasering a subject is not meant to be "punishment", it's done to force him to comply.

Maybe you can clarify what you mean? You've conceded that tasers sometimes result in death, and agree that death is not the appropriate punishment for resisting arrest. That makes sense, but then you justify that tasering is not meant as a punishment, but to force people to comply. If death isn't an appropriate punishment for resisting arrest, it certainly isn't a good means to force someone to comply. "You have a right to remain lifeless and unresponsive..."

I don't care if you change your statement to include 99.99999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999 99999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999 9% of subjects in a safe manner. The problem is that the penalty for resisting arrest should never be death.

I don't necessarily disagree with this statement, but unfortunately this doesn't work in our non-ideal world. Humans are frail, but cops have to enforce the laws - there is no perfect solution. Guns certainly aren't safe, high-speed chases aren't safe. There is a 99.9999...% chance that a cop will accidentally shoot someone, yet I think it is imperative that cops carry guns (until such a time that no criminals carry guns...).

The best thing we can do is train our police officers to use these tools in the safest manner possible. Every officer carries a gun, yet there are very few (though highly reported) gun accidents. I wouldn't be surprised if there were more gun accidents by civilians during hunting season than all year by the police. If there is a significant risk of a taser killing someone, then obviously this needs to be investigated. With better training, there might be a way to reduce these accidents. However, the unfortunate truth is that there will always be a finite risk... it's unavoidable. However, again, the tool is still necessary. For every occasional abuse of a taser, there are probably 50 cases where the use of a taser significantly reduced the risk of injury, or even death.

[CheebaNinja]

IMO the cops should get a pay cut if it takes 6 of em and a taser to take down one kid not even throwing punches.I would have had his face in the ground first time he tryed to run. JK ppl but in all seroiusness this was no Rodney King incident. :2thumbs:

[Thrashdragon]

You're right, death is too harsh a penalty for resisting arrest, but tasering a subject is not meant to be "punishment", it's done to force him to comply.

Maybe you can clarify what you mean? You've conceded that tasers sometimes result in death, and agree that death is not the appropriate punishment for resisting arrest. That makes sense, but then you justify that tasering is not meant as a punishment, but to force people to comply. If death isn't an appropriate punishment for resisting arrest, it certainly isn't a good means to force someone to comply. "You have a right to remain lifeless and unresponsive..."

Death is a rare side effect of taser use that can effect people with certain medical conditions (frequently heart problems brought on by extensive drug use). No one looks at the business end of a taser and thinks they're being threatened with death, just a whole lot of pain and the irrefutable fact that they're not going to get away. If tasers were considerably more dangerous to the average person, their use would not be justified in situations like this one. Since they are not, they are very effective at forcing compliance, and the fact that a very small percentage of the population may suffer adverse effects from being zapped should not invalidate the use of the tool for its intended purpose. Death may be too harsh a penalty (unfortunately) for resisting, but it's too rare of an occurence to be relevant.

This kid is a bratty little waste of oxygen that is going to cost Florida taxpayers a boatload of money before he's out of the news, I hope he gets to do a little time in general population with Bubba for this stunt.

[mapes]

About a year ago here in Santa Cruz some distraught guy grabbed a little girl from a grocery store and right on the main street held a knife to her. They finally negotiated the rlease of the girl but the guy held the knife to his own throat..kind blazing saddles style. Well up walks one cop from behind and he levels a shotgun. Boom shotgun beanbag took that dude down...That was pretty righteous

[{CLR} ObiTroy]

... This kid is a bratty little waste of oxygen that is going to cost Florida taxpayers a boatload of money before he's out of the news, I hope he gets to do a little time in general population with Bubba for this stunt.

:2thumbs:

[ThisElfRocksHard]

I hadn't seen this version before (WARNING: HARSH LANGUAGE):

http://blog.wired.com/27bstroke6/2007/09/dont-tase-me-br.html

Contrary to what was stated previously, he was OBVIOUSLY in handcuffs when he first started saying "Don't tase me, bro". Do you still maintain that the tasering was necessary? And some of you persist that he dererved to be tasered for being unruly? Using your first amendment right earns you 70,000 volts?

I am sorry, I can't wrap my brain around that.

[thedeadlyassassin]

Wow, that video explained a lot more. Police brutality :|

[jaspurr]

When I saw the report, witnesses were saying the dude was already on his stomach and cuffed when they zapped him. If so, he's going to make himself a lot of money.

-Rand

Just watched that...possible case of police brutality (again) ?

For resisting arrest?

I don't actually remember hearing anyone saying he was under arrest. Whatever I think it was too much force using the taser. especially as he was already on the ground with cops around him and he was begging not to be tasered. It must have been very frightening for those cops. :|

[Thrashdragon]

I hadn't seen this version before (WARNING: HARSH LANGUAGE):

http://blog.wired.com/27bstroke6/2007/09/dont-tase-me-br.html

Contrary to what was stated previously, he was OBVIOUSLY in handcuffs when he first started saying "Don't tase me, bro". Do you still maintain that the tasering was necessary? And some of you persist that he dererved to be tasered for being unruly? Using your first amendment right earns you 70,000 volts?

I am sorry, I can't wrap my brain around that.

I actually can't tell if the cuffs are on him yet at the point where they taser him, you can tell they're trying to get them on, but it doesn't matter, you can clearly see that he was still struggling. I have no problems whatsoever with the use of a taser to subdue an unruly subject, and especially a spoiled little bastard that thinks his rights are more important than anyone else's. He wasn't tasered for using his first amendment rights (which don't apply in a private forum with specific guidelines that he chose to ignore), he was tasered for fighting with the cops. He could have walked outside and ranted and raved about whatever he wanted, and no one would have stopped him. Of course then no one would watch his YouTube video.

A lot of people are asking why couldn't that many cops subdue him without the taser and carry him out...they could have, but why should they risk injury to themselves, or worry about him lashing out and striking a bystander, when they can just taser him and be done with it? Safety of the suspect comes after the safety of the public.

Police brutality? Give me a break. Except for a 6-7 second jolt, he wasn't hurt at all, except for his pride when he starts crying "ow ow ow ow". I could listen to that part of the video all day long.

[WhIsKyTaNgO1]

Being on our fire dept I know lot of the cops here. When our police received their issued taser I asked a cop what the rules of engagement were. He told me the person has ONE chance to comply and they are authorized to use the tazer. So, you get one chance to do as youre told or they can tase you. From Ive seen people usually get several chances, but there will always be trigger happy cops.
:dbz:

[FieryDragon]

as mentioned earlier about cops being able to take down suspect or whatever u wan to call them in this case...but im sure tyhat thrshdragon and elfrockshard can verify that police training shows multible methods in physical combat that r easy and in the long runless threatoning to themselve and the detainee! correct me if im wrong but as of using the simple yet dumb way, they could of brought him down using his own wieght and movement which would of been less painful but had actual physical effort...LAZY cops! i have personal experiance when i was little...they took down my brother and detained me since i was present palying a video game, nonetheless...what else would i be doing at home! ok my :2cents: r in. nothing more said by me!

[Rovey Wade]

Happened to come across a related video:

http://www.cnn.com/video/#/video/us/2007/09/20/sinkovich.woman.tasered.wytv

[thedeadlyassassin]

Happened to come across a related video:

http://www.cnn.com/video/#/video/us/2007/09/20/sinkovich.woman.tasered.wytv


Again, people should feel protected by the police, not afraid of them. I'm more worried about a police knocking on my door then a physco-path.

[jaspurr]

I am sure if in my day I could subdue a psychotic patient with the help of 2 female nurses then they could have done better, oh yes, without injuring ourselves. If we played by the rules the cops do we would have tasered every patient in the unit multiple times each day. I am all for the safety of the law enforcers but you may as well take the stance of them not getting out of their vehicles for feasr of being injured. You assess the risks. If it was a 1 or 2 on 1 scenario it could have been justified, as it was, well thats already been said. :|

[linemanstud]

I agree that the dude shouldn't have gone running up there like that and he should have been far more calm about everything, but I also think that the cops shouldn't have used the tazer. There are better ways of subduing someone than that, especially with 6 of them.