POWS

[drunken_chef]

what is your opinion on POWs holding government office?

[TheSilentAssassin]

Why would POWs be a suspect?

[drunken_chef]

you edited your post kyle =)

why would POWs be suspect? IMO, no POW should ever hold our highest office. I don't just mean John McCain. give an enemy of ours a couple years to play with the mind of said officer and then elect them to be commander and chief....am I the only person here that hears a bell tolling?

ps, did you google keating5 and read some of the hits?

[drunken_chef]

didn't mean this to be a debate between kyle and myself. I would like others opinions on this subject.

[jaspurr]

Atleast McCain has lived life for real and he is only likely to serve one term. Just my opinion of course as a humble foreigner:) At least you get to choose who the candidate for party leader is. It is still a bit of the old boys network in the UK. :|

[Thrashdragon]

Why would he be suspect? Are you implying that he could've been brainwashed while captive? I hope not, that's ridiculous. I would think the only reason to not want a former POW in office is that they would might carry a slight grudge against whomever had them in captivity. So if McCain wins, and we suddenly and arbitrarily nuke Vietnam, remember you read it here first. :D

[TheSilentAssassin]

Why would he be suspect? Are you implying that he could've been brainwashed while captive? I hope not, that's ridiculous. I would think the only reason to not want a former POW in office is that they would might carry a slight grudge against whomever had them in captivity. So if McCain wins, and we suddenly and arbitrarily nuke Vietnam, remember you read it here first. :D

Sounds like The Manchurian Candidate to me... :D
Right now we need a President who has actual military experience and not some paper pushing politician who has never even been to Iraq.

[LIMEY]

In McCain's case I am not worried abou him being a POW as much as the fact he is NOT conservative and that he is 72!!!!

[(DSP)-Bar]

The fact that he was a POW means that he has some combat XP... unlike Hilliary or Obama. While everyone wants to pull out of this war. I personally hope we stay at it, I am sick of losing because we "pull out" and I know Hilliary and Obama will pull out.

[omfg karl marx]

Should a POW be automatically disqualified from holding the Presidency? No. Would I vote for McCain? No. I have a problem with anyone who is willing to use racial slurs and be proud of it.

[(DSP)-Bar]

I have a problem with anyone who is willing to use racial slurs and be proud of it.


Then you will have a problem with every single President because I bet you that every single one has said something racist while holding office. Personally I think that gives him some points cause he at least has the guts to admit it.


That comment is a Double-Edged sword, you say that about one thing and you better follow it through with everything else in your life or you will just contradict yourself.

[Thrashdragon]

While I'm no fan of McCain, nearly everyone on the planet has used a racial slur at some point in their life. At least he had a good reason for it, a better reason than any of us have. I can't imagine not hating the people that put him through what he went through while a POW.

[-IRC-MIKE]

Why would he be suspect? Are you implying that he could've been brainwashed while captive? I hope not, that's ridiculous. I would think the only reason to not want a former POW in office is that they would might carry a slight grudge against whomever had them in captivity. So if McCain wins, and we suddenly and arbitrarily nuke Vietnam, remember you read it here first. :D

Sounds like The Manchurian Candidate to me... :D
Right now we need a President who has actual military experience and not some paper pushing politician who has never even been to Iraq.

+1

I believe you BOTH hit the nail on the head. Right now would be the perfect time to have not only a president with actual military experience, but a POW too. He knows the importance of the lives of our troops and would defend the lives of the troops at all costs. I believe we'd see a great improvement in Iraq if he took over office. More of an improvement than we've been seeing, which we have seen great improvement already.

I don't, however, think McCain would go on the offensive toward vietnam. There's no reason for it. Not only that, he admittedly has sympathy for the country, and has reportedly been there many times since he was released, and has said that the people of the country will always be his friends. He has let go of the past and said he realizes that the people back then are not the same people that are there today. He also said that he admires their cultures.

[BlackArrow]

Druken,

I just don't get your question. I get a feeling you watched the Manchurian Candidate too many times.



Sorry - just my two cents.

[xGoblin013x]

I believe we'd see a great improvement in Iraq if he took over office. More of an improvement than we've been seeing, which we have seen great improvement already.

And I think you all remember that it was McCain who was suggesting up the troop levels in the first case... or it might have been someone before him and he was the first person to get it out on the news.

Anyway, having a POW in office doesnt seem like a problem with the exception of a grudge... but you've all said he's gone to Vietnam and pitied them so...
Otherwise, the question "Do we want a POW in the White House?" makes less sense than "Do we want a black/woman/parapalegic/Catholic in the White House?"

[Trooper110]

I'm not voting because I don't necessarily see them in either way. They're just another person, and I'd vote for them based on their stated goals and how well I think they'd do as president, just as I'll do with all other candidates, doesn't matter their sex/race/background. If worst comes to worst, you know, there are ways to remove Presidents who are doing their job badly.

[mapes]

Saying McCain has some military experience is like saying humans need air. Besides being a POW he flew sorties over Vietnam and both his father and grandfather were in the Navy. I think one was an admiral and on was a sub captain. Basically he has more military experience than any president in the last twenty years or so.


Do I think the Vietnamese (or China) has brain washed him? No. I like some things about McCain. Like

Against Torture
Against an Constitutional amendment defining a marriage between a man and a woman.
All of the conservative Republicans don't like him (thats a plus in my book)


I do disagree with him on some other things

I was kinda disappointed when he said initially he wasn't going to be playing up to the Evangelicals....and then a year later was giving a graduation speech at Oral Roberts University....


He's not your standard Republican thats for sure......

The odd thing is I havn't really made up my mind about him.

[TheSilentAssassin]

I believe we'd see a great improvement in Iraq if he took over office. More of an improvement than we've been seeing, which we have seen great improvement already.

And I think you all remember that it was McCain who was suggesting up the troop levels in the first case... or it might have been someone before him and he was the first person to get it out on the news.

Anyway, having a POW in office doesnt seem like a problem with the exception of a grudge... but you've all said he's gone to Vietnam and pitied them so...
Otherwise, the question "Do we want a POW in the White House?" makes less sense than "Do we want a black/woman/parapalegic/Catholic in the White House?"

He said that the Rumsfield strategy would fail, and supported Bush's troop surge. He did not come up with the plan, he merely supported it. Not having someone with military experience as a President really is not an option right now. If Clinton gets elected, we might as well let Bill hold onto the football. :D

[TheSilentAssassin]

Who thinks Ron Paul should drop out by the way?

[Rovey Wade]

Who thinks Ron Paul should drop out by the way?


Certainly the greater news media. :twisted:

[BenKenobi]

Who thinks Ron Paul should drop out by the way?


Certainly the greater news media. :twisted:

LOL

[Thrashdragon]

Who thinks Ron Paul should drop out by the way?


Certainly the greater news media. :twisted:

:lol: Sad but true.

Hillary used the fake crying thing again yesterday. That's what I want in a leader, one that sheds crocodile tears at the first sign of adversity. :roll:

[-IRC-MIKE]

I Like what Sean Hannity said on Hannity and Colmbes last night on the news. He said this to all the people on the other end of the video conference who were completely for Barrack Obama. He said:

Ok all you guys are voting for Obama... I want you .. ANY ONE OF YOU... to name ONE thing he has done for our government or our country. Name ONE POSITIVE thing he has done.....

The guy passed the mic around and the only thing anyone had to say was "He has a good personality"..

THATS IT!

So.. ahem.. I ask any of you Obama fans.. Name ONE THING he has done for our country or for our government...

And you can't yet you want this guy to RUN our country? He hasn't done anything good so far.

[Rovey Wade]

I Like what Sean Hannity said on Hannity and Colmbes last night on the news. He said this to all the people on the other end of the video conference who were completely for Barrack Obama. He said:

Ok all you guys are voting for Obama... I want you .. ANY ONE OF YOU... to name ONE thing he has done for our government or our country. Name ONE POSITIVE thing he has done.....

The guy passed the mic around and the only thing anyone had to say was "He has a good personality"..

THATS IT!

So.. ahem.. I ask any of you Obama fans.. Name ONE THING he has done for our country or for our government...

And you can't yet you want this guy to RUN our country? He hasn't done anything good so far.



If this "polling" was done in a fox news studio or in a pro fox news crowd, then the demonstration really holds no water.

Barrack Obama has done just as much as any other senator. Just because the average person may not follow the day-to-day workings of the Senate, doesn't mean they can't get behind his ideals.



note: I haven't decided who I'll vote for yet so don't assume I'm pandering for Obama.

[Dr_Zoidberg]

The fact that he was a POW means that he has some combat XP... unlike Hilliary or Obama. While everyone wants to pull out of this war. I personally hope we stay at it, I am sick of losing because we "pull out" and I know Hilliary and Obama will pull out.

I think "winning" the war is now is impossible. The war was finished when Saddam was caught. What is going on now is rather like a football game where one team is victorious but a bunch of fans have waltzed onto the pitch to challenge them, and the team has stayed behind to play them. :(

<<< English guy, so feel free to tell me to bugger off about the presidency but I don't like any of these candidates. McCain is the one I would favour the most though. Even if he is a Republican, he has seen the ugly side of life. An essential quality for someone who controls the fates of many, in my opinion.

[(DSP)-Bar]

go ahead and say its impossible, The reason we are losing is because everyone thinks we are losing. Truth be told there will never be peace in the middle east. But we can take control of Iraq if we wanted to. Just the other 99% of the nation thinks we are losing and the few like me that don't think so have to put up with a another loss.

[xGoblin013x]

I think "winning" the war is now is impossible. The war was finished when Saddam was caught. What is going on now is rather like a football game where one team is victorious but a bunch of fans have waltzed onto the pitch to challenge them, and the team has stayed behind to play them. :(


thats the best analogy I've heard yet of the war...
and the winning team is afraid to really sock the fans during the quasi-game because their owners (a Government afraid of ACLU) will fire them and put them in jail.

Personally, I think we should stay in... but according to a lot of "the experts," our army isn't big enough to occupy countries anymore... We're putting our men and women on like a 6 month leave and then their gone for 2 years...

I agree it isn't fair, but if we leave now, Iraq is just gonna fester up like Afghanistan did almost 20 years ago. I wish we could just draft the increasing numbers of chronically unemployed and welfare-ridden adults. Of course, the blasted ACLU would have a fit...

[-IRC-MIKE]

I Like what Sean Hannity said on Hannity and Colmbes last night on the news. He said this to all the people on the other end of the video conference who were completely for Barrack Obama. He said:

Ok all you guys are voting for Obama... I want you .. ANY ONE OF YOU... to name ONE thing he has done for our government or our country. Name ONE POSITIVE thing he has done.....

The guy passed the mic around and the only thing anyone had to say was "He has a good personality"..

THATS IT!

So.. ahem.. I ask any of you Obama fans.. Name ONE THING he has done for our country or for our government...

And you can't yet you want this guy to RUN our country? He hasn't done anything good so far.



If this "polling" was done in a fox news studio or in a pro fox news crowd, then the demonstration really holds no water.

Barrack Obama has done just as much as any other senator. Just because the average person may not follow the day-to-day workings of the Senate, doesn't mean they can't get behind his ideals.



note: I haven't decided who I'll vote for yet so don't assume I'm pandering for Obama.Quick google for me then. One thing Obama has done positively for this nation....one bill he's passed that isn't in dispute... anything... anything at all. You don't have to follow him to know this.

It wasn't done in a pro fox news crowd, infact the other end of the videophone was another news media provider.. I don't know for sure which one. It was also a pro-Obama gathering. That's why he brought them on there.. all the obama slingers were hooting and carrying on and he asked a simple question that none of them could answer.

[Rovey Wade]

Quick google for me then. One thing Obama has done positively for this nation....one bill he's passed that isn't in dispute... anything... anything at all. You don't have to follow him to know this.

It wasn't done in a pro fox news crowd, infact the other end of the videophone was another news media provider.. I don't know for sure which one. It was also a pro-Obama gathering. That's why he brought them on there.. all the obama slingers were hooting and carrying on and he asked a simple question that none of them could answer.


Your isolated incident doesn't mean a)Barack Obama hasn't accomplished anything in his political carreer or that b)his average supporter doesn't know what he's done or stands for.


You can go to obama.senate.gov and look at his voting record and work in the Senate if you so please. Though, I expect you won't.

Also, you haven't addressed my argument that they could support his ideals.

[Thrashdragon]

Out of curiosity, of the five people that voted "Suspect" in this poll, do the other four think he's unfit to lead the country because he was a prisoner of war at one point, or do they just dislike McCain?

[-IRC-MIKE]

Quick google for me then. One thing Obama has done positively for this nation....one bill he's passed that isn't in dispute... anything... anything at all. You don't have to follow him to know this.

It wasn't done in a pro fox news crowd, infact the other end of the videophone was another news media provider.. I don't know for sure which one. It was also a pro-Obama gathering. That's why he brought them on there.. all the obama slingers were hooting and carrying on and he asked a simple question that none of them could answer.


Your isolated incident doesn't mean a)Barack Obama hasn't accomplished anything in his political carreer or that b)his average supporter doesn't know what he's done or stands for.


You can go to obama.senate.gov and look at his voting record and work in the Senate if you so please. Though, I expect you won't.

Also, you haven't addressed my argument that they could support his ideals.

Of course.. the most important issue. The ideals... how could I overlook this. For one, I don't believe that any of the candidates are doing anything other than telling what everyone wants to hear. I support at least ONE idea that every candidate has, and I don't support all the ideals of NONE of them. What on God's green earth does all of it mean when he has not done one thing supporting his political stance on any aspect. Some have even mentioned that "He is from my state" and that is about as far as it goes... I guess that's how he got nominated in the first place.

Out of curiosity, of the five people that voted "Suspect" in this poll, do the other four think he's unfit to lead the country because he was a prisoner of war at one point, or do they just dislike McCain?

I think that may be the case. They just don't like him because he has been a POW. Suspect of WHAT? .. thats what I'd like to know.

I'm sure he didn't ASK to be captured and BEGGED for more when he was tortured repeatedly day after day. Are all veterans considered Suspects of something or just the ones who happened to get captured and held prisoner? UNBELIEVABLE and a DISGRACE.

[thedeadlyassassin]

I'm not going to vote for him, and him being a POW doesn't change my mind. Sure I appreciate his service, but he's not the only POW that was treated like crap.


If he becomes president, good for him, I'm not too worried about him being a POW, but if he dares blame vietnamese people for what happened then I'll change my current status of "whoevers president I respsect them for taking such a hard job" to "It's all the presidents fault that everythings happening"... well maybe not that intense.

[TheSilentAssassin]

Besides being a POW he flew sorties over Vietnam and both his father and grandfather were in the Navy. I think one was an admiral and on was a sub captain.

John Sidney McCain Sr. (Grandfather)
(August 9, 1884 ? September 6, 1945)
Was a U.S. Navy Admiral. He held several command assignments during the Pacific campaign of World War II.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/8/8f/Halsey_Mccain.jpg

John Sidney McCain, Jr.
(January 17, 1911 ? March 22, 1981) was a four star admiral in the United States Navy who served in World War II through the Vietnam War.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/a/a4/John_S_McCain_Jr.jpg

Looks like McCain has the nomination in the back so far!! :D

[Dr_Zoidberg]

McCain, Obama, or Hillary....

As an English fella, it's not my place to say such things. But for what it's worth I can't see any one of these people being worse than the GW Bush and Dick Cheney pair.

[-IRC-MIKE]

I would suspect that the 6 people who voted "Suspect" must not be American.

Saying McCain has some military experience is like saying humans need air. Besides being a POW he flew sorties over Vietnam and both his father and grandfather were in the Navy. I think one was an admiral and on was a sub captain. Basically he has more military experience than any president in the last twenty years or so.

He, like his ancestors, did NOT get that highly decorated suit from an army surplus store, and they sure as hell didn't get there by skipping school and getting stoned or drunk. His family has more proof of dedication to this country than possibly everyone who is a member of CainsLair put together.

Put his life and limb on the line and would have paid the ultimate price (almost did) for YOUR freedom.

THAT is enough to earn my vote.

[mapes]

I Like what Sean Hannity said on Hannity and Colmbes last night on the news. He said this to all the people on the other end of the video conference who were completely for Barrack Obama. He said:

Ok all you guys are voting for Obama... I want you .. ANY ONE OF YOU... to name ONE thing he has done for our government or our country. Name ONE POSITIVE thing he has done.....

The guy passed the mic around and the only thing anyone had to say was "He has a good personality"..

THATS IT!

So.. ahem.. I ask any of you Obama fans.. Name ONE THING he has done for our country or for our government...




And you can't yet you want this guy to RUN our country? He hasn't done anything good so far.



If this "polling" was done in a fox news studio or in a pro fox news crowd, then the demonstration really holds no water.

Barrack Obama has done just as much as any other senator. Just because the average person may not follow the day-to-day workings of the Senate, doesn't mean they can't get behind his ideals.



note: I haven't decided who I'll vote for yet so don't assume I'm pandering for Obama.Quick google for me then. One thing Obama has done positively for this nation....one bill he's passed that isn't in dispute... anything... anything at all. You don't have to follow him to know this.

It wasn't done in a pro fox news crowd, infact the other end of the videophone was another news media provider.. I don't know for sure which one. It was also a pro-Obama gathering. That's why he brought them on there.. all the obama slingers were hooting and carrying on and he asked a simple question that none of them could answer.


Not that I'm a supporter or anything but, I heard on NPR he voted yes on a measure to increase veteran benefits that recently came to the senate.

I believe that answers your question Mike. As for Hannity and Colmbes that show is pure BS. I tend to agree with this John Stewart quote when he was on Crossfire

But the thing is that this -- you're doing theater, when you should be doing debate

Those shows are not about information or increasing the publics awareness about important issues. It's for entertainment....They're demagogues

i.e. a person, esp. an orator or political leader, who gains power and popularity by arousing the emotions, passions, and prejudices of the people.

[-IRC-MIKE]

Not that I'm disagreeing with you in the least, rather agreeing to most everything you've said, but you're stating that nothing from the H & C news show is based on factual evidence? Or is it that you believe it is fabricated?

[mapes]

Not that I'm disagreeing with you in the least, rather agreeing to most everything you've said, but you're stating that nothing from the H & C news show is based on factual evidence? Or is it that you believe it is fabricated?

I believe they're demagogues. Yes the info is based on something I'm sure. However the way they present the information makes it of dubious value.

[Dr_Zoidberg]

I'm not going to vote for him, and him being a POW doesn't change my mind. Sure I appreciate his service, but he's not the only POW that was treated like crap.

Talking of crap, there is a new book out on the current Presidential race.

http://i264.photobucket.com/albums/ii175/SamFultonSr/everyone.jpg

[-IRC-MIKE]

<<< English guy, so feel free to tell me to bugger off about the presidency but I don't like any of these candidates. McCain is the one I would favour the most though. Even if he is a Republican, he has seen the ugly side of life. An essential quality for someone who controls the fates of many, in my opinion.

+1

[-IRC-MIKE]

Obama looks like he is enjoying that poop a little too much..

(Sorry, I quoted you before you changed it.)

[Dr_Zoidberg]

Obama looks like he is enjoying that poop a little too much..

(Sorry, I quoted you before you changed it.)

I never changed it, thats an old post in this thread that's still up.

And indeed that pic of Obama had me in stitches when I first saw it. :D He obviously eats more fibre than the other three presidential hopefuls.

[-IRC-MIKE]

LMAO!!!!!!!!

[Hammy]

what is your opinion on POWs holding government office?

This kind of question is a problem for most people because it is a singular statement and close ended.

What is your context?

I have the assumptive power, but I also have the restraint to reserve judgement until I have more understanding of your question.

Basically: What are you asking me?

It may as well be as ridiculous as that Bob Dole post.


Bob Dole- Yes or Banana?


Huh??? :?

[-IRC-MIKE]

This kind of question is a problem for most people because it is a singular statement and close ended.
+1

What is your context?
+1

I have the assumptive power, but I also have the restraint to reserve judgement until I have more understanding of your question.
+1

Basically: What are you asking me?
+1

It may as well be as ridiculous as that Bob Dole post.
+1

Bob Dole- Yes or Banana?

-1

Huh??? :?
+100